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  1. #1
    Tommy Volume is offline I Ain't One Of Those Posters
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    Default Grime and The Tories / Labour Governments

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    what u rate is a signifier of what grime is
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    Ur up there w/ the best too
    Quote Originally Posted by Lemstar
    Big H will never have a Fire in the Booth
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    There's no track where Big H slews JME
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    Don't hate because your on the bus and i'm in the scenic comfy.

  2. #2
    devilboy's Avatar
    devilboy is offline I Was Like You Rudeboy
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    man like gibbo

    thought u would of jumped on this ages ago, makes sense to publish as a last minute mind-changer to the easily swayed "yoof"

  3. #3
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    My issue with #grimeforcorbyn is twofold.

    1, Corbyn is a socialist and Grime extols ultra-captalist ideals of wealth aspirations and buying into corporate brands and mass-marketing etc. The 2 are inherently incomaptible politically. I wonder whether Corbyn grime fans even know what Corbyn's vision of a socialist Britain looks like...

    2, Where's the actual #grimeforcorbyn TUNES?? In the 80s we had nuff political UK raps dealing with the situations we were under. But for all the hype talk from every other MC, where's the music to express the sentiment?? They're musicians and music is one of the most powerful tools to express a message so why not put your support into a catchy track that could help garner support for him?
    Last edited by nothing like anything; 7th June '17 at 04:53 PM.
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  4. #4
    Tommy Volume is offline I Ain't One Of Those Posters
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    Quote Originally Posted by devilboy View Post
    man like gibbo

    thought u would of jumped on this ages ago, makes sense to publish as a last minute mind-changer to the easily swayed "yoof"
    tbf the piece isn't even intended to sway anyone or change any minds. It's just a run-down of grime's history with governments.

    I actually wasn't a big fan of the whole #Grime4Corbyn thing, despite being right in the middle of the venn diagram

    Quote Originally Posted by devilboy View Post
    man like gibbo

    thought u would of jumped on this ages ago, makes sense to publish as a last minute mind-changer to the easily swayed "yoof"
    tbf the piece isn't even intended to sway anyone or change any minds. It's just a run-down of grime's history with governments.

    I actually wasn't a big fan of the whole #Grime4Corbyn thing, despite being right in the middle of the venn diagram
    Quote Originally Posted by The Narcissist View Post
    what u rate is a signifier of what grime is
    Quote Originally Posted by The Narcissist View Post
    Ur up there w/ the best too
    Quote Originally Posted by Lemstar
    Big H will never have a Fire in the Booth
    Quote Originally Posted by Lemstar
    There's no track where Big H slews JME
    Quote Originally Posted by Lemstar View Post
    Don't hate because your on the bus and i'm in the scenic comfy.

  5. #5
    Malcolm Tucker_'s Avatar
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    Young people think this is X factor or something; you're voting for a party, not one bloke, and that party is fucked. There's so much internal division and a bunch of middle class university students who can't be arsed to pay their tuition fees are calling too many shots. A vote for Labour is a vote for instability and no real change, a Tory vote is a vote for stability and no real change

    Wagwan with jme tho

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by nothing like anything View Post
    My issue with #grimeforcorbyn is twofold.

    1, Corbyn is a socialist and Grime extols ultra-captalist ideals of wealth aspirations and buying into corporate brands and mass-marketing etc. The 2 are inherently incomaptible politically. I wonder whether Corbyn grime fans even know what Corbyn's vision of a socialist Britain looks like...
    I don't think this is quite it but there are def some real problems with this 'grime4corbyn' thing. sure, there is a individualist-aspiration pulse in grime inherited from hip hop & the broader neoliberal / late-capitalist historical context; but at the same time that individualism frequently shades into dangerous isolation, which comes out as paranoia, aggression (passive or direct), melancholy -- all sorts, and some of the best grime gets both across at the same time.

    there were (were) things going on in grime, aesthetically & culturally, which went way beyond the not v interesting or informed opinions of any particular artists. I reckon the sharper GF users would sense what I mean by this even if most of them are long gone now & I can't articulate the point v well (it's like 2am). some of the stuff I have in mind: how grime production managed to incorporate such a vast range of different genres and styles; grime's 'uncanny' resemblance to hip hop; how "DIY" so much of the production & dissemination of grime was 10 to 15 years ago; even a lot of the innovations in rapping/MCing which hadn't really existed in previous musics of its kind.

    grime was a product of its time & it's never going to come back. weirdly it was both of its era & against it -- but not in the cheap 'futurism' that a lot of awful theorists have tried mutilating it into. so it's gone but at the same time I don't think we've even come close to really realising what it really was.

    it was healthier 'politically' when it was at most moodily antagonistic to the politics of the day. "I'm a problem for Anthony Blair".

    Quote Originally Posted by nothing like anything View Post
    My issue with #grimeforcorbyn is twofold.

    1, Corbyn is a socialist and Grime extols ultra-captalist ideals of wealth aspirations and buying into corporate brands and mass-marketing etc. The 2 are inherently incomaptible politically. I wonder whether Corbyn grime fans even know what Corbyn's vision of a socialist Britain looks like...
    I don't think this is quite it but there are def some real problems with this 'grime4corbyn' thing. sure, there is a individualist-aspiration pulse in grime inherited from hip hop & the broader neoliberal / late-capitalist historical context; but at the same time that individualism frequently shades into dangerous isolation, which comes out as paranoia, aggression (passive or direct), melancholy -- all sorts, and some of the best grime gets both across at the same time.

    there were (were) things going on in grime, aesthetically & culturally, which went way beyond the not v interesting or informed opinions of any particular artists. I reckon the sharper GF users would sense what I mean by this even if most of them are long gone now & I can't articulate the point v well (it's like 2am). some of the stuff I have in mind: how grime production managed to incorporate such a vast range of different genres and styles; grime's 'uncanny' resemblance to hip hop; how "DIY" so much of the production & dissemination of grime was 10 to 15 years ago; even a lot of the innovations in rapping/MCing which hadn't really existed in previous musics of its kind.

    grime was a product of its time & it's never going to come back. weirdly it was both of its era & against it -- but not in the cheap 'futurism' that a lot of awful theorists have tried mutilating it into. so it's gone but at the same time I don't think we've even come close to really realising what it really was.

    it was healthier 'politically' when it was at most moodily antagonistic to the politics of the day. "I'm a problem for Anthony Blair".

  7. #7
    Tommy Volume is offline I Ain't One Of Those Posters
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    lmao @Pirate_Prentice remember when you said that the popularity of German Whip was because of the 2008 financial crisis?
    Quote Originally Posted by The Narcissist View Post
    what u rate is a signifier of what grime is
    Quote Originally Posted by The Narcissist View Post
    Ur up there w/ the best too
    Quote Originally Posted by Lemstar
    Big H will never have a Fire in the Booth
    Quote Originally Posted by Lemstar
    There's no track where Big H slews JME
    Quote Originally Posted by Lemstar View Post
    Don't hate because your on the bus and i'm in the scenic comfy.

  8. #8
    Aceldama is offline Post Ina Thread, Post Ina Thread
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    Quote Originally Posted by nothing like anything View Post
    Corbyn is a socialist and Grime extols ultra-captalist ideals of wealth aspirations and buying into corporate brands and mass-marketing etc. The 2 are inherently incomaptible politically. I wonder whether Corbyn grime fans even know what Corbyn's vision of a socialist Britain looks like...
    The wealth aspiration in grime - where it exists, it's not pervasive - comes from the cultural dominance of hip hop and consumerism. It's a bit like how rolling hi hats were popularised by trap and became a part of grime, despite being intensely disliked by lots of grime fans. Grime in it's purest form is a societal influence in the other direction.

    The grime aesthetic has it's roots in both the comparative poverty of the big early artists (who didn't have the money to wear chains even if they wanted to) and an ongoing active rejection of what is considered to be hip hop. Someone like P Money is clearly well off but still choses to wear a black hoodie in 90% of his videos, choosing to dress like that goes hand in hand with his repeated boasts about how committed to grime he is. It's a rejection of hip hop and an attempt to differentiate himself from hip hop and it's associations with conspicuous displays of wealth as well as an attempt to visually associate himself with the streets and early grime pioneers. Same with Stormzy, Wiley and anyone else who sticks to wearing tracksuits anyone could buy in JD Sport.

    Culturally it's no where near as anti capitalist as punk, but when the most corporate thing in an average grime video is sportswear branding it's also a long way away from ultra capitalist and a long way from "inherently incompatible" with Corbyn's politics. The Guardian interviewed various grime MCs before the election - including Maxsta, AJ Tracey and Slix - to get their views on Corbyn and they all gave coherent statements in support of his policies.


    TL;DR Grime isn't ultra capitalist. Staying in touch with working class roots is an important part of grime. Someone choose to wear branded clothing isn't incompatible with them supporting the social change Corbyn wants.
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    Wearing a hoodie or tracksuit is not a rejection of hip hop. Hoodies and name brand tracksuits are the uniform of hip hop and have been since the early 80s! If grime was a rejection of hip hop why has it so freely adopted most of its vernacular from it? (Eg. Grime, grimey, spit, bars, MC, merk, roll deep, feds, gat, lit, body, shank, jake etc...)

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  10. #10
    Aceldama is offline Post Ina Thread, Post Ina Thread
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    Quote Originally Posted by nothing like anything View Post
    Wearing a hoodie or tracksuit is not a rejection of hip hop. Hoodies and name brand tracksuits are the uniform of hip hop and have been since the early 80s! If grime was a rejection of hip hop why has it so freely adopted most of its vernacular from it? (Eg. Grime, grimey, spit, bars, MC, merk, roll deep, feds, gat, lit, body, shank, jake etc...)
    Keep living in the eighties if you want, but when people think of hip hop in the 21st century they think of people that dress like Lil Wayne not people that dress like Eazy E. Don't pretend that conspicuous wealth isn't associated with hip hop.

    Hip Hop aesthetic:


    Click here to watch the video on YouTube.

    Grime aesthetic:


    Click here to watch the video on YouTube.

    Speaks for itself.


    I've already addressed the cultural dominance of hip hop and the same argument applies to language. You thinking the word grime is vernacular adopted from hip hop still deserves special mention though, stupidest thing I've read in a long time
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  11. #11
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    It is adopted from rap. Grime and grimey was a common word used to describe hardcore rap in mid 90s.

    On your other point I know rap is associated with conspicuous wealth but grime (not rap) was the subject in relation to Corbyn so not sure what the relevance of you saying that is...?

    Incidentally 80s hip hop including UK ish had lots of political and socialist themes and songs/focus.
    But for all this grime4corbyn malarkey, I've yet to hear a single lyric let alone track written on the matter...

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    And if a man can borrow a phrase like Roll Deep from rap to name a crew, then why is it so preposterous to assert they also borrowed the word Grime itself, given the wide usage of the word in rap in the years directly preceding the inception of grime?

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  13. #13
    Pirate_Prentice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tommy Volume View Post
    lmao @Pirate_Prentice remember when you said that the popularity of German Whip was because of the 2008 financial crisis?
    no, but I do remember you being an embarrassing Peep Show type loser with a v oddly shaped face & hair made of ragged velcro.

  14. #14
    Pirate_Prentice's Avatar
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    have you worked out who Danny Trejo is yet m8?

  15. #15
    Tommy Volume is offline I Ain't One Of Those Posters
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pirate_Prentice View Post
    no, but I do remember you being an embarrassing Peep Show type loser with a v oddly shaped face & hair made of ragged velcro.
    You're thinking of Jamie m8. Easy mistake to make, but I was the handsome one.

    Anyway, enough about all this. What do you think about the war in Kosovo working as a catalyst for grime's split from garage? Might be some mileage in it? It's the kind of stupid shite you'd come out with anyway.

    As for Danny Trejo - I thought I knew, but looking back the reference is lost on me tbh. Feel free to fill me in if you like, I'm not really bothered either way.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Narcissist View Post
    what u rate is a signifier of what grime is
    Quote Originally Posted by The Narcissist View Post
    Ur up there w/ the best too
    Quote Originally Posted by Lemstar
    Big H will never have a Fire in the Booth
    Quote Originally Posted by Lemstar
    There's no track where Big H slews JME
    Quote Originally Posted by Lemstar View Post
    Don't hate because your on the bus and i'm in the scenic comfy.

  16. #16
    Pirate_Prentice's Avatar
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    no m8, I'm thinking of you, Paul Gibbins, the one with hair like the material on a primary schooler's shoe and who writes like a primary schooler in a paper['s rundown blog section] which barely exists anymore.

    honestly couldn't say who Jamie is, nor where or even if this comment of mine took place but I'm glad that my #content has had such longevity for you.

    no m8, I'm thinking of you, Paul Gibbins, the one with hair like the material on a primary schooler's shoe and who writes like a primary schooler in a paper['s rundown blog section] which barely exists anymore.

    honestly couldn't say who Jamie is, nor where or even if this comment of mine took place but I'm glad that my #content has had such longevity for you.

  17. #17
    mdma123's Avatar
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    ragged velcro
    It's not that deep, till I hold your head in the water like John Baptist

    Quote Originally Posted by L.E.V View Post
    stop chatting shit it's norm for people to not wipe there arse after a shit if you're going in the bath, the heat evaporates the poo u prick.

  18. #18
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    articles like this are why/how grime lost its way. completely gentrified by kids that think their 'woke'

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