Tom Cleverely

[Hij]

Cleverly has been around for longer than just this season at united. He has had 2 good seasons before this.

I'm not denying that, I'm not denying he's a great prospect either.

He was removed via injury from the squad anyway - but I guess I'm also questioning how England sides are selected and that young players from top 6-7 clubs are often picked on reputation due to the club they play for, or how highly rated they are by their managers over form and consistency.

Like Gerrard under performing (but you can understand why Pearce might have to select him as an experienced player) - I found it odd how Cleverely came back from injury and was instantly in the England squad. I'm sure if we dig deeper there are other English players of all ages that have played for most of the season, who would perhaps be a bit more deserving? I don't think Cleverely is anywhere near that position of "automatic" call up- despite form over a period of weeks ala Rooney, Ferdinand, Gerrard, Lampard etc.

Pearce brought Clevz through the u21's so he knows what hes about.

Good point.

[Big 45]

I'm not saying he is shit btw, I've just noticed that (probably because) he plays for Man United, he's hyped up so much. I think Arsenal capitulating also played a massive part in that 8-2, hilarious if you are putting the whole result down to Cleverley playing, this is the hyperbole I'm talking about.

When Cleverley was playing he was a key part of the midfield that allowed the rest of the team to function properly. Our overall gameplay was smooth, lots of possesion and passing which resulted in goals.

When he got injured, we struggled to play the same and all of sudden everyone was saying we have a crisis in midfield.

lol the 8-2 was just an example, obviously it wasn't all just down to him :laugh; but him being in the midfield was like the missing piece to a jigsaw and allowed us to play well.

I watched the pre-season games United played in the USA and with Cleverley playing, our overall game was so much better than it had been towards the end of last season.

4-1, 3-1, 4-0 and we won 2-1 in a friendly against Barcelona. (ye american teams lulululu and it was only a friendly, but the quality was still there)

3-2 against man city in the community shield then we beat tottenham 3-0, arsenal 8-2, bolton 5-0.

He's very good at passing, keeping possesion and feeding the ball to attackers in good position.

He's a key part of United's midfield and when he plays United as a team play much better.

If people wanna call him overated cool, but to me as a United fan he's essential to the team and to their success in the future.

[Zoffie]

Pearce brought Clevz through the u21's so he knows what hes about.

Pearce has gone on & on about Oxlade whilst he was at the u21's, so much more so than he ever praised Cleverly, even though he has.
He knows what Ox is about but, didn't call him up because he thought it was better for him to get more minutes for the u21's.
If Cleverly could still qualify for the U21's like Henderson does thennnn.....

When Cleverley was playing he was a key part of the midfield that allowed the rest of the team to function properly. Our overall gameplay was smooth, lots of possesion and passing which resulted in goals.

When he got injured, we struggled to play the same and all of sudden everyone was saying we have a crisis in midfield.

lol the 8-2 was just an example, obviously it wasn't all just down to him :laugh; but him being in the midfield was like the missing piece to a jigsaw and allowed us to play well.

I watched the pre-season games United played in the USA and with Cleverley playing, our overall game was so much better than it had been towards the end of last season.

4-1, 3-1, 4-0 and we won 2-1 in a friendly against Barcelona. (ye american teams lulululu and it was only a friendly, but the quality was still there)

3-2 against man city in the community shield then we beat tottenham 3-0, arsenal 8-2, bolton 5-0.

He's very good at passing, keeping possesion and feeding the ball to attackers in good position.

He's a key part of United's midfield and when he plays United as a team play much better.

If people wanna call him overated cool, but to me as a United fan he's essential to the team and to their success in the future.

He also played a gang of games for Wigan when they almost got relegated, just as he wasn't responsible for their poor form, he's not necessarily responsible for your early season form. Possibly.. We'll see if he really is the difference for United into the future.

[Big 45]

Him & Wellbeck link up disgustingly still. Chances are Wellbeck will be playing without Rooney so it's worth taking him.

They both play sick with Rooney aswell so that could be a madness.


Knowing England it will come to nothing though.

.

trust.

He was obviously chosen for England because Pearce has seen his quality in the under21's and how well he plays with welbeck.

[Hij]

Not even calling him over rated, just questioning how he has got so highly rated so quickly. I will do my best to keep an eye on him when he plays for United now and check him out myself I don't know much.

Although talking about games where midfielders have bossed, it reminds me of "Liverpool Fans" who say shit like "We shouldn't have sold Alonso, look at how he ran the game against Man United when we won 4-1" and I'm like "Hold up dickhead, he didn't play a minute of that game, Lucas played his position".

[chris89]

it's cos he plays for man utd, that's all

[Pristine Condition]

When Cleverly came on against City in the Community Shield at half time >>>>>>>>

Just watch that game to know what he's about.

[Big 45]

He also played a gang of games for Wigan when they almost got relegated, just as he wasn't responsible for their poor form, he's not necessarily responsible for your early season form. Possibly.. We'll see if he really is the difference for United into the future.

lol you can't compare the 2, the poor form of a team dosen't come down solely to 1 player.

But a whether a team plays well or not can depend on certain key players. Take Rooney, Vidic or Valencia out of the team and we aren't the same.

Once Giggs + Scholes (for real this time lol) retires United will never be the same.... but put in a few decent replacements in (Cleverley), and the team are ok.

I will say though, he does need to improve on his shooting from what I've seen lol.

If he was banging in goals or running around the pitch constantly chasing the ball like a dog (wilshere) then the neutrals would obviously notice him more, but he does a good job at what he's supposed to be doing and it works well for the team.

[Julio Cesar]

When Cleverly came on against City in the Community Shield at half time >>>>>>>>

Just watch that game to know what he's about.

So you think its ok to base your judgement on a player based on 45 minutes?

[Pristine Condition]

So you think its ok to base your judgement on a player based on 45 minutes?

Didn't say that. That game was the reason why Sir Alex started the season with him. We started the season well when Clevs and Anderson was bossing. As soon as they got injured we haven't really been the same tbh

[FoundTheGif]

I like to believe fans of the club.. Until I can form a strong opinion (almost like innocent until proven guilty.)

The thing is, when you watch every game of your club you get to see things that other people miss in highlight packages.
So they have inside knowledge usually. Cleverly is almost 3 years older than Wilshere is & Wilshere is "said" to be better.
We'll see on this one, SAF was going to keep Cleverly around last season, but, it was the signing of Bebe that convinced Fergie to loan him out.

My friend has seen Lansbury & Cleverly play for Watford together in the same team & you wouldn't get a conclusive opinion that Cleverly is far better than Lansbury I don't think from Watford fans.

I don't want to write cleverly off at all because he has a bit of everything, technique, he scores goals, a bit of pace, capable at small dribbles.
Ferguson picks those types of players, like Fletcher's & turns them into good servants.

I think when you bring up the case of Lampard v Gerrard, you can see clearly that Gerrard is the more of a enigmatic player than Lampard is, but Lampard has made a career through diligence.

I have to say for me Hij bringing up Henderson is relevant, in the u21's for instance, Cleverly didn't eclipse Henderson in his performances.
However, perhaps the answer is in the fact that when Henderson got called up last time, it almost seemed as if it had a negative effect on him, as he didn't impress as they may have hoped, some of the media slagged off his quality & it was deemed as maybe a little too early for him to be integrated.

Pearce makes weird decisions any way, there was no justification whatsoever of calling Frazier-Campbell up.
Pearce selection's in his period as u21 manager shows that he lets loyalty affect his decision making. Mancienne had been in the youth set-up for years & the pairing of Jones & Smalling as a CB partnership qualified them for the tournament. Mancienne was made captain because of his experience from the last tournament & captains have to play. I wouldn't mind Mancienne as the disturber in midfield, it's actually a good tactical move, but, only when you surround him with quality possession players & Cleverly or Henderson didn't look like good enough players to make it work. Plus, he played Mancienne as an anchor rather than like Gattuso which showed a lack of understanding for me from Pearce.

So keep expecting weird selections if he does remain manager.

On Oxlade the reason why he didn't get called up I think is because I believe they do plan to not only take him to the Euro's this year, but they want him to represent England in the Euro's next year for the U21's as well. So he will be flitting in between the squads, depending on the game time one is offering. I still think he has a good chance of making the Euro's.. Just most of the players u21 under Pearce will still expected to be playing with the U21's

Pearce played Cleverley as a LW, same position he played for Wigan last year. He's a CM, imo playts a bit like Scholes - minus the long passes. Lots of short passes and runs. In fact he barely started for the U21 because Pearce constantly picked Henderson, as a CM and he played shit lol.

Cleverley tbh>>>>>

@Big 45 what you said basically

[Zoffie]

Cleverly played as a LW 0_o... I actually watched it. As I remember he played every game

Welbeck
Danny Rose-----------Sturridge
Cleverly---Henderson
Mancienne
Bertrand-----------------Walker
Smalling --- Jones

Cleverly played LW for Wigan & for Watford & as I say, I tend to take note when fans rate one of their own players.

Just I believe the rationale for Cleverly getting picked with so few games after injury over Henderson is more to do with age than anything else.

Liverpool fans aren't impressed as much with Henderson, United fans are more than happy with Cleverly.. Probably influenced by one costing their club £20m ( Commolli came out today saying that the majority of their big spending is done 0_o ) & the other being an academy product.

From what I have personally seen so far (& for instance I saw his classy pre-season goal & for the U21's)..

Cleverly has good attributes & so does Henderson.

@Big 45 Cleverly scored a lot of goals for Watford & I think he is more of a goal threat than Wilshere. Wilshere just looks so much classier, which helps.

It's not about scoring goals & for instance, Xavi goes about his business keeping Barca ticking over & his effectiveness cannot be appreciated in snapshots like a goalscorer or a trickster.

Is Clevery really a midfield dictator? he didn't do that for the u21's but, most United fans say that after losing Cleverly, you lost the ability to play as well in midfield, which suggests that he is a midfield playmaker.. I don't know.

[FoundTheGif]

Cleverly played as a LW 0_o... I actually watched it. As I remember he played every game

Welbeck
Danny Rose-----------Sturridge
Cleverly---Henderson
Mancienne
Bertrand-----------------Walker
Smalling --- Jones

Cleverly played LW for Wigan & for Watford & as I say, I tend to take note when fans rate one of their own players.

Just I believe the rationale for Cleverly getting picked with so few games after injury over Henderson is more to do with age than anything else.

Liverpool fans aren't impressed as much with Henderson, United fans are more than happy with Cleverly.. Probably influenced by one costing their club £20m ( Commolli came out today saying that the majority of their big spending is done 0_o ) & the other being an academy product.

From what I have personally seen so far (& for instance I saw his classy pre-season goal & for the U21's)..

Cleverly has good attributes & so does Henderson.

@Big45 Cleverly scored a lot of goals for Watford & I think he is more of a goal threat than Wilshere. Wilshere just looks so much classier, which helps.

Cleverley barely played in the U21 Championships, the actual game I did watch he came on in the last 20 mins and played LW

[Zoffie]

Hmmm.. Maybe I'm wrong..I'll check it out later

Cleverly started 2 of the 3 games.
Interestingly when you're talking about Stuart Pearce calling up Cleverly because he knows how good he is from the u21's.

Cleverly & Henderson did play in midfield together in that 1st game against Spain. Pearce dropped Cleverly for the next game, bringing Rodwell in & he stuck with Henderson.

Cleverly started the last game as well, but, Henderson started all 3 for Stuart Pearce at the u21's.

I never rate a player based on managerial decision's but, it's significant because as I have said, the reason why Cleverly got called up & not Henderson is the same reason Ox is in the u21's, he believes that as many u21 players as possible should play in the tournament u21 tournaments..

It doesn't mean he won't play them in both if they are very good & playing regularly in the EPL for a top side, like I suppose they may do with Ox

[MyLord]

@Hij I agree tbh.

[Grimes]

wellbeck and cleverly are highly overated

[Big 45]

Highly overated compared to what though?

They're not made out to be world class players or the next Ronaldos.They're just good young english players with potential.

Sounds like some of youlot are just upset henderson didn't make the england team or that wilshere isn't the main focus of the media atm.

[kilik]

Highly overated compared to what though?

They're not made out to be world class players or the next Ronaldos.They're just good young english players with potential.

Sounds like youlot are just upset henderson didn't make the england team or that wilshere isn't the main focus of the media atm.

.

.

welbeck has done well these past 2 years

[datnigganev]

Cleverley is overly hyped, united fans just like him because he's the type of player they had been lacking. Henderson though? come on son.

[FoundTheGif]

Cleverley is overly hyped, united fans just like him because he's the type of player they had been lacking. Henderson though? come on son.

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