Grime's Future

[Pred]

The whole scene is confused. Break into the commercial world and conquer the charts? Stay true to the roots with Grime as it should be? Vote and discuss.

When I say solid underground scene, I don't mean NO chart/popular commercial songs, rather that Grime should not strive to be the next Hip-Hop. DnB thrives, and Dubstep is there already in my eyes. It's where the scene came from, and where it should stay. People just need to give back to the system (i.e. buy products)

[Quality Control]

...i think we all know what the fans want... but the MCs want money and they think they'll get it from cheap hip-pop imitations...

[Demos]

i want a solid underground scene.

mainstream just waters down the music

[Kaychi]

i want it 2 go mainstream, but i dnt see it happenin without it losing sumthin that made it what it is!!

get me?

Remedy

[Jay05]

They r plenty of scenes who dont seek mainstream exposure, grime should look at them and not hip hop

[Sick Boy]

Hip Hop has able to keep both a healthy underground and mainstream presence with some incredibly good music coming out of both ends and is appreciated on different levels by all sorts of different people. It is now a cultural institution in North America.

This is what I would like to see happen with Grime in the UK.

[feasible_weasel]

hip-hop is already a popular mcing scene. best leave that commercially because grime will lose trying to compete

[Quality Control]

Hip Hop has able to keep both a healthy underground and mainstream presence with some incredibly good music coming out of both ends and appreciated on different levels by all sorts of different people. It is now a cultural institution in North America.

This is what I would like to see happen with Grime.

...grime's potential is no where near being on the scale of hip-hop, but it can definitely get a lot bigger than it is now if MCs keep making grime music for their love of grime music and in time the scene will grow, gain more and more recognition and hopefully spread to places besides London...

[Stringer_Bell]

mainstream and underground

[R-Style]

grime being made 4 the love of grime >>> mans tryna make a quick buck or fuck a myspace chick

[Sick Boy]

...grime's potential is no where near being on the scale of hip-hop, but it can definitely get a lot bigger than it is now if MCs keep making grime music for their love of grime music and in time the scene will grow, gain more and more recognition and hopefully spread to places besides London...

I think it can be very big and long-standing in this country at the very least - and would do well at spreading across Europe. Loads of European countries have been recieving grime well - France, Germany, Spain, etc. It probably won't ever really be integrated and accepted fully into North America because hip hop culture is pretty much impenetrable now worldwide, and Americans have trouble viewing grime as being any else other than weird-ass hip hop.

Another reason it's difficult for grime to take off in North America is that there is no such thing as British communities. Dancehall does well because of the big Jamaican immigrant communities and their influence, but all British people just become integrated within a generation or so into just becoming Americans.

[Quality Control]

I think it can be very big and long-standing in this country at the very least - and would do well at spreading across Europe. Loads of European countries have been recieving grime well - France, Germany, Spain, etc. It probably won't ever really be integrated and accepted fully into North America because hip hop culture is pretty much impenetrable now worldwide, and Americans have trouble viewing grime as being any else other than weird-ass hip hop.

Another reason it's difficult for grime to take off in North America is that there is no such thing as British communities. Dancehall does well because of the big Jamaican immigrant communities and their influence, but all British people just become integrated within a generation or so into just becoming Americans.

...the population difference in the founding countries of the two genres is the biggest drawback for grime... while London's population can only secure around 5 or 6 really good MCs (i mean the proper good ones at the top) at a time, all the states involved in hip-hop mean it can have a lot more genuinely, really talented MCs active at a time... the genres are pretty much incomparable in terms of their earning potential... it'd be better to compare grime with an all-British scene like British Indie rock... where that's at right now is where grime can only hope to some day be... in fact just half of the success of British Indie rock would be great...

[Channel_E-D]

This is an interesting thing, because if Grime was to go "Mainstream" like option one (hip hop style) then it won't be Grime would it? So if it went that route, Grime would be dead. UK Hip Hop would be alive.

If it went the other route, underground, then I suppose Grime would be Grime and well alive.

[Sick Boy]

...the population difference in the founding countries of the two genres is the biggest drawback for grime... while London's population can only secure around 5 or 6 really good MCs (i mean the proper good ones at the top) at a time, all the states involved in hip-hop mean it can have a lot more genuinely, really talented MCs active at a time... the genres are pretty much incomparable in terms of their earning potential... it'd be better to compare grime with an all-British scene like British Indie rock... where that's at right now is where grime can only hope to some day be... in fact just half of the success of British Indie rock would be great...

I only use hip hop as a comparison to show how it could become a cultural institution and voice for urban Britain. It offers a lot more identity-wise than UK hip hop does (since hip hop doesn't belong to us), and a lot more than rave-centric sounds like drum and bass (which didn't offer the same voice and lyricism) and dubstep (which is, for the most part, non-vocal).

Grime is powerful because it is both lyrically based and has an incredibly unique, distinct sound whose roots lie heavily in British and immigrant rave culture. It will outlast dubstep without a doubt in my mind, and with the right perserverence, support, and attitude, will come to mean a lot more in this country.

[Aych]

lol @ Risky being the only guy who votes for dont know/dont care.

[S.Man]

i put dnt know coz i think there are flaws with goin mainstream and remaining underground so id rather just let it take its own course!

[RISKY!]

lol @ Risky being the only guy who votes for dont know/dont care.

=)

http://www.grimeforum.com/forum/poll.php?do=showresults&pollid=16

[Quality Control]

...the population difference in the founding countries of the two genres is the biggest drawback for grime... while London's population can only secure around 5 or 6 really good MCs (i mean the proper good ones at the top) at a time, all the states involved in hip-hop mean it can have a lot more genuinely, really talented MCs active at a time... the genres are pretty much incomparable in terms of their earning potential... it'd be better to compare grime with an all-British scene like British Indie rock... where that's at right now is where grime can only hope to some day be... in fact just half of the success of British Indie rock would be great...

...in retrospect i was chatting air...

...grime is unlike any scene England's ever had before so it's incomparable to pretty much everything...

[Hij]

I want grime to be like an Ice Berg.

You got most of it below the surface bubbling away, but a small part in the light above the surface repping.

I know thats in the middle, and its not a poll option but thats how I envisage it.

[Retrofreak]

Grime is different from most other uk scenes because it's vocal driven also.
I voted for mainstream,because its' just a matter of time before the songs get better and it becomes mainstream imo.

[Hij]

Grime is different from most other uk scenes because it's vocal driven also.
I voted for mainstream,because its' just a matter of time before the songs get better and it becomes mainstream imo.
Agree with that really.

[natzta]

this music will always be around and there will always be a underground and commercial devide

wiley>>>kano

[S.Man]

I want grime to be like an Ice Berg.

You got most of it below the surface bubbling away, but a small part in the light above the surface repping.

I know thats in the middle, and its not a poll option but thats how I envisage it.


I think this would be the best solution!

That way it keeps its raw/street appeal n still has enough money coming into the scene!

[adidasgrandad]

the scene already gets attention from mianstream audiences but at the same time its an underground scene.
i call it popular underground music...just like drum and bass is

['nuum general]

Due to the scene being largely MC based there is always going to be the influences of the US emcees/rappers. These influences will lead to attempts to achieve mainstream success.

On the other side the structure of the scene with radio & rave sets rather than PAs or hi hop style freestyles should help the scene remain relatively underground as sets are not going to be popular to mainstream fans.

This will lead to a scene which is in different levels with people like dizzee & kano in a MC dominated mainstream and viewed by the ingorant general public as "uk rappers". The underground scene will still be mc based but will be influenced much more by djs & producers. Radio sets, raves & mixtapes will be the main outlets for this very much as the scene is now.

Thats how i see it going

[i tell da truth]

the scene already gets attention from mianstream audiences but at the same time its an underground scene.
i call it popular underground music...just like drum and bass is


grime could only wish to become a solid scene like drum and bass.

how the scene is now in grime is what it will be like for years to come-a shambles.

and i dont wanna hear no bullshit bout how grime needs time to build cause dubstep are already well on their way to becoming like the drum and bass scene.

[TRU_G]

grime being made 4 the love of grime >>> mans tryna make a quick buck or fuck a myspace chick

Get me...and you can tell who those guys are instantly

Wiley is one of them

But anyway, the guy talking about Europe has it right, need to take it overseas more often. Countries like Sweden, Finland, Germany all have thriving underground dnace music scene's, they love that all things electronic.

Like I been hearing stuff from some new genre from over in Denmark/Finland and it's called Skweee, its much slower and abstract but all the sounds used are basically Grime, European people love that dark/synth orientated sort of music

and plus over there u don't have problems with raves

[adidasgrandad]

grime could only wish to become a solid scene like drum and bass.

how the scene is now in grime is what it will be like for years to come-a shambles.

and i dont wanna hear no bullshit bout how grime needs time to build cause dubstep are already well on their way to becoming like the drum and bass scene.

yeah grime is a shambles at moment but it could be sorted if the leading people take control but, at the same time, it seems they dont know how to

and yeah grime needs to be taken abroad more

['nuum general]

grime needs to be taken abroad more

why take it abroad when they haven't taken it north of watford yet?

[frankD]

If vinyl and club nights were working then we would be enjoying a solid underground scene right now.

But grime has become a scene in limbo, almost a holding place for people waiting for thier chance at mainstream.

[frankD]

why take it abroad when they haven't taken it north of watford yet?

Exactly.

Grime is no way established.

I think we are in for more of the same to be honest.

[adidasgrandad]

why take it abroad when they haven't taken it north of watford yet?

can you really say that they aint taken it out of london when you got bare people from brimingham, manchester, liverpool etc who listen to grime. but it aint stable yet, in a year or two i think grime will be a stable nationwide scene.

dont forget this thread is about 'grimes future' so that is what i was talking about.

[4737]

until artists get real and tour the uk a bit, asking for sensible fees to play in places where their fanbase is currently tiny instead of asking for 700/800 quid when the likelihood is the door take won't even touch that, only then will you see the scene begin to develop into something healthy.

promotion is key. trying to break into the mainstream is like running before you can walk. when you're building a house, you make foundations to build on first, otherwise the whole lot will sink into the mud.

t.

['nuum general]

until artists get real and tour the uk a bit, asking for sensible fees to play in places where their fanbase is currently tiny instead of asking for 700/800 quid when the likelihood is the door take won't even touch that, only then will you see the scene begin to develop into something healthy.



t.

its stupid what people want for a rave, when the smoking ban tour was on it was £4 entry and the place which wasn't massive still was just over half full. Raves are the best way to build up a fanbase (along with radio). Thats why so many people like tempa t

[Joe]

its big

[4737]

its stupid what people want for a rave, when the smoking ban tour was on it was £4 entry and the place which wasn't massive still was just over half full. Raves are the best way to build up a fanbase (along with radio). Thats why so many people like tempa t

We were gonna book JME and Skepta up here but the prices we were quoted were beyond what we could afford. Thing is, we're not even promoting gigs to turn a profit.

There are a few forward-thinking heads in the scene though who know the deal and haven't let london-centric insular views get in the way. Those are the kinda people we'll be booking in future.

t.

[Sick Boy]

grime could only wish to become a solid scene like drum and bass.

how the scene is now in grime is what it will be like for years to come-a shambles.

and i dont wanna hear no bullshit bout how grime needs time to build cause dubstep are already well on their way to becoming like the drum and bass scene.

The reason for this is that in dubstep the fans are SUPPORTIVE and WELCOME new people into their scene. They don't spend half their time on the internet slagging off the hard work of all the main players making moves and downloading all their music off the internet for free. There is actually a community where people are coming together and putting the work in, starting labels, getting radio shows, etc. where everyone shares the same view of pushing the genre forward. Grime fans are just permanently whingeing about everything.

That and obviously dubstep didn't have to deal with the London Met shutting down every rave for no real good reason. That probably made things a little bit easier for them, no?

[Fewie]

Id rather it stay undergound but it a massive scene wid raves vinyl bein released and cds that are available in shops all over the uk rather than just london, cause if it mainstream it will be watered down shit,

Whatever happens i jus hope its still about and it dont die out, cause grime>>>>>>>>>>>>all other genres

[Pred]

Wow, nice input you lot. I will edit this post tomorrow (or post again), but just wanted to bump for now.

[frankD]

We were gonna book JME and Skepta up here but the prices we were quoted were beyond what we could afford. Thing is, we're not even promoting gigs to turn a profit.

There are a few forward-thinking heads in the scene though who know the deal and haven't let london-centric insular views get in the way. Those are the kinda people we'll be booking in future.

t.

These mc's who think they are bigger than they are now, will soon be no ones.

[frankD]

We were gonna book JME and Skepta up here but the prices we were quoted were beyond what we could afford. Thing is, we're not even promoting gigs to turn a profit.

There are a few forward-thinking heads in the scene though who know the deal and haven't let london-centric insular views get in the way. Those are the kinda people we'll be booking in future.

t.

Some of the scene has put money over music from day one.

[fuk off]

I Hope Grime goes down the same road as dnb wid a good underground scene wid a solid fanbase + people in it 4 da love of the music look what goin commercial done to hip hop in da US da record companies watered it down + it lost its roots

[RIP Jakey]

I want grime to be like an Ice Berg.

You got most of it below the surface bubbling away, but a small part in the light above the surface repping.

I know thats in the middle, and its not a poll option but thats how I envisage it.

yh thts wht i want,

but i'd rather have a solid underground scene than some soulja boy line dancin watered down shit so voted solid underground scene

[Quality Control]

Some of the scene has put money over music from day one.

..99% of the scene has in recent years.. that's a big part of why the genre hasn't made any major steps forward for a while...

..name some top MCs who seem to be in it for the music rather than the money!?.. you can count them on one hand i bet...

..i mean obviously they're always gonna be after money but the majority of good MCs clearly don't give a shit about grime or music at all, they're solely in it for cash..

[Pred]

Okay. What I should have said regarding the underground thing is that there's no problem with videos on Base/a couple singles here and there for those who get lucky enough, as that happens with all underground scenes anyway. Underground doesn't mean no commercially recognised tracks ever, just not often. :)